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Susan Hyatt of PILLBOX
March, 2001
London, England
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I first met vocalist/guitarist Susan Hyatt when she was a member of FELINE along with Debbie Diamond. (Also see the interview with Debbie elsewhere at this site.) I think we were all in the bathroom at some trashy Hollywood nightclub when I met both chicks. Anyhow, Susan now lives abroad. She's got her own record label and her new band, PILLBOX, has a new CD out. I cruised the website of her new band a bit. I read her press package, which is something I don't usually do before talking to musicians because, as you know, I'm a know it all. Well one thing I read struck a sensitive chord.
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| (c) Diane Carter |
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Unlike so many musicians I've met, Susan is pretty willing to speak all that's on her mind on the topic of the shitty music business. And things are as shitty as ever right now. In a nutshell, here's what's been fucking up your favorite bands and singers in recent years. Bands that sell low quantities of their records are being dropped from major record labels and/or traded amongst the main quartet of lame ass labels as if they were bent bubble gum cards. Even the musicians that sell lots of records are being treated like third class citizens, slaves, and undesirables by the industry heads. They are being misled and robbed beyond belief. There is a lot of bullshit that the normal, everyday fan does not know...but should know about. And, in fact, Courtney Love - with her own money - is currently battling the industry to get some better laws written to protect musicians, and win back the rights of the artists.
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Right out the gate, I asked Susan her thoughts on all this.
"What needs to change in the music industry is the complete control of the five major conglomerates who run this whole thing, and force feed the public crap. Payola is all over the place. The whole industry is run on C&H - cocaine and hookers. Musicians are such passionate people, they will literally sign any deal to get their music heard. Major labels know this, and that is why bands only end up (getting paid) a few cents per each CD sold in a store while the label makes 80% of the profit. I think Courtney Love is a visionary. If anyone can make a dent in how fucked up this industry is, it's her."
I asked Susan if she thought Courtney's bloody battle with the merciless and shady industry would win Courtney some respect with the musicians that love to talk shit about her.
"I don't care what musicians say about Courtney. Most of the musicians are men anyway, and they can't handle a tough woman who is smart and knows what she wants. Courtney takes no shit. She grabs people by the balls. Men are afraid of her 'cause she castrates them with a mere glare. Most musicians are so self-obsessed that they probably won't take notice of who the actual heroine will be in this play anyway...."
Now in the 21st Century one would think we as a species would have evolved a lot more than we have. We as human beings still suck at lots of stuff - especially in the boy-girl thing. The music industry is still a boy's club after all these years. It's a nauseating, sexist experience for most - probably all - women. Oddly enough, I haven't been able to find many women who want to talk about it. All I can assess is there is still a Hollywood Black List. But, Susan ain't one of those tight-lipped women.
"In the U.S. recording industry there is outright sexism. Women still have a lot to prove. If you are a songwriter and a musician it takes a hell of a lot longer to get noticed than if you aim to be a pop tart like Jennifer Lopez..."
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And then she summed it all up describing the simple mentality of the typical industry man who wears snake-skinned boots:
"Either you are a lesbian and a well-respected musician but no one wants to fuck you or you are a whore who is a puppet for the real talent - the man pulling your strings. Look at Shirley Manson with Garbage. As much as I love her, everyone knows or assumes (her success) is all because of Butch Vig. I want to completely destroy that vision...I can play everything on my records and produce them. I run my own label and yet I'm attractive and I am bisexual. Today's woman has to be everything. You can no longer gain power by mere sexual manipulation. There are real leaders around today, like Hillary Clinton."
The third taboo in the music world: gay rockstars. I asked Susan's opinion as to whether sexual preference still scares the hell out of the industry people, and if rockstars are still being told to keep quiet about their lifestyle.
"There are a lot of gay rockstars and I think that's great. Artists have always been different people with open minds. That's what has made their art so great - from Michaelangelo to David Bowie. If sexual preference scares anybody in this day and age, then I really feel sorry for those people. Maybe they need to re-examine their own sexuality if they feel so threatened. Yeah, there is still some fear based on some really naïve people living in the boonies and buying Creed records. No, I don't think rockstars are being told to keep quiet. I think controversy sells records. People are well aware of many rap artists' criminal pasts, and it seems to legitimize their music...."
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It's a disturbing statement - and maybe ironic - when American artists have to leave our country to pursue their dream. Jimi Hendrix did it in the Sixties, and Chrissie Hynde did it in the Seventies. They both moved to England where they found acceptance. I can't think off the top of my head what American band left The States for the UK in the Eighties, but in 1993 Susan Hyatt took a flying leap to London.
"I needed a fresh start in the music industry. L.A. was sucking my soul dry, and I needed to find the inspiration that originally led me to become a musician. All of my favorite bands growing up were British - The Sex Pistols, The Clash, The Buzzcocks. There are not a lot of American musicians here. I don't believe they could face the scrutiny. English people do not exactly 'embrace' Americans. I have lived here for seven years and I am still looked at with suspicion. I just got my British passport and I'm gonna make sure everyone damn well knows I am a citizen!...I spend six months out of the year in The States. PILLBOX has played L.A., NYC, Boston, Seattle, Portland. We do this every year...."
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When she comes back to the U.S. do her friends notice a Brit accent in her speech?
"No. I have developed no accent, just some of the slang like 'dodgy' and 'knackered'. My two favorite words. I have too strong a sense of self to influence my accent."
I have a bit of a fascination with the British way. It happened some time in the Eighties, when I got over my fascination with everything NYC. So I took this opportunity to ask Susan some stuff about the lifestyle overseas.
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"I have been all around Europe. It's great that you can take in so many different cultures in a matter of hours...The UK bands I fancy are the VegasTones - they are from Australia but are based in London. Radiohead - of course. Supergrass - who are totally underrated. And the goddess - P.J. Harvey..."
In my view of things it seems that the youth of England have two choices in life: football (which is soccer to us) or being a pop star. Am I right or am I right?
"I would say football is the most important thing in the common British man's life. Music is a lot less important. But football songs are the ultimate for the public to digest. As far as making money - working in the City as a banker is your ticket to wealth. Not being a pop star, not by a long shot...Americans have a very 'Hollywood' view of Britain, as if Hugh Grant and the Queen make up the majority of the population. If you want a real perspective of British life, rent Gary Oldman's film 'Nil By Mouth'".
Does she miss anything about America?
"I miss American people. That's what I miss most. It's still my culture, and the way you grow up forms who you are today. Kids in the UK don't even know who Cheap Trick and RUSH are! Jesus!...I think it's really sad the way the (U.S.) market is so R&B and rap based. I don't understand how, with all due respect, white suburban kids can relate to this genre of music. The saddest part is when white musicians try to be black. I can imagine that is quite ridiculed in professional circles. I am Persian myself, so I fall into a completely different and fucked up category. The UK is more open to unconventional quirky music. Although, they are (currently) suffering from this girl band/boy band pop music as well."
I've read a lot of the reviews and the critics love PILLBOX. And I do too. I mean, here's this American chick living across the big pond and not only winning over a tough lot of music lovers but she's also running her own record label. Not an easy task, from what I've been told by other rocker chicks I've interviewed for this website. Susan told me about her record company, and her strategies.
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"I started NYC Records Ltd. with my American partner Jennifer Ivory. I felt I had to take charge of my own career. Since I was always so heavily involved in the business side to my band I thought I would take it to another level. Instead of waiting around for some record executive to get a clue I could release my own records and start a recording history. I only wish I had started this ten years ago. I also want to release other American artists on this label. So, all interested bands or artists should contact me. I want to end the artist struggle."
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There are a couple things I've always wondered about the independent record labels that artists start. Where does most of the money get spent when producing your own product; and, does the artist end up with anything close to full control of sales?
"Most of the money is usually spent on promotion. These days you can pretty much do home digital or ProTools recordings that are absolutely cool. (And) yes, I have 100% control of the music and sales. It's a beautiful thing."
I've personally dealt with distributors in two different realms: publication and film. Not easy people to convince. Is it the same in the music business?
"It is very hard to get distribution. In The States distributors do fuck all. You have to call all the retail stores in the U.S. yourself and convince them to order your record from the distributor. In the UK the distributor takes care of everything. We have Pinnacle - the best distributor in the UK. We were very lucky to get that. And we got that because of PILLBOX's 6-year history in the UK. The best way to sell records independently now is through the Internet. I say concentrate on getting a killer website together and completely market yourself to all the kids who are interested in bands like yourself."
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One thing I try not to do as a music writer is compare one artist to another. Sometimes it's unavoidable, but usually I don't. It's not fair to the artist's style and blah blah blah. I asked Susan what she thinks about some music writers comparing her to some pretty heavy women on the Billboard charts.
"Well at least they are comparing me to artists I respect and listen to. I think the Pretenders and Garbage comparisons are more 'vocally' based, as my music is not electronically based. My guitars are much heavier and raw than both bands. Pillbox is more PUNK rock live, and we ROCK on record. I do most of the songwriting myself, although recently on this new EP - and with the addition of guitarist Neil Athale - we have been collaborating. Pillbox started off as a 3-piece, so this other guitarist vibe is brand new. The band is: Sean Harrington - bass; Mark Bullock - drums, Neil and, yes, I am the only American in my band."
In October of 2000 PILLBOX released a full-length CD. 'Gimme What I Want' is an album filled with raw emotion and candid lyrics about a love life with more downs than ups. I dig this record so much. In May of 2001 the band released an EP called 'Sterilise Me'. I thought it was a little strange that PILLBOX would release two records so close together.
"The new EP has all new political and social songs. No sex this time around. Since this is only an EP we don't feel that it is too close of a release. Plus, I am very prolific as an artist. I need to release new records constantly to stabilize my sanity. In the UK it is very common for artists to release records every three months."
[See the full reviews else where at this site.]
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I've mentioned the PANDORAS a few times on this site - most recently during the Debbie Diamond interview. The PANDORAS was a great band fronted by Paula Pierce. Another version of PANDORAS actually co-existed for a short while, fronted by Gwynne Kahn. (It's a long ass story.) I knew Debbie was in Gwynne's PANDORAS but I didn't know Susan played with Paula. I was totally shocked.
"I was the guitarist when the Pandoras were on Elektra Records. My stint with them was short. The band got dropped a few months after the record ('Rock Hard') was recorded. I quit because they moved into a more 'Poison-kind-of-rock' direction that I was not interested in."
I had to ask the hard question next, which was about the rumors that surrounded the death of Paula Pierce the Summer of 1990. I had a hard time with at least one of the rumours - that Paula o.d'ed.
"She never did drugs. That is so ridiculous and naïve for anyone to say and believe such a cliché. She was a total health freak, and treated her body with the utmost respect. Paula Pierce was one of my best friends. She died from a brain aneurysm. She was a beautiful and talented person and her death was a real tragedy. It really hit me hard. She never got to fulfill her dream and show the world how fantastic she really was. She recorded her last song on my 16-track before she died. She was buried with her favorite yellow dress that I gave her. Paul was one of the best front women I have ever seen in my life."
I plan to write an extensive story on the PANDORAS in the coming months.
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I have two ways in deciding if someone is cool enough for me to talk to. I have to know if they've ever seen (and if they liked) a 1980 documentary by Penelope Spheeris called 'The Decline of Western Civilization'. It's a punk rock classic. The other way I decide if I wanna talk to someone is if they've actually seen the lesser-known sequel - 'The Decline of Western Civilization, The Metal Years' (1988). Susan was living in L.A. at the time when both films were shot. In fact, her ex-bandmate in FELINE, keyboard player Anna Spheeris is the daughter of the filmmaker Penelope. How cool is that! I ask Susan if she liked the 'Metal Years' version.
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"A load of my friends were in it. (But) I definitely prefer the first 'Decline'. I was at the Starwood watching the Germs, Fear, and X when I was a little kid. So, it really hit home. I was never into metal. I am a punk rock chick through and through...Penelope was very protective over Anna. Although, she let her go out with Nikki Sixx - AFTER Catholic school and band rehearsal...."
FELINE was a melodic hard rock band in the heavy metal climate of the late Eighties. I loved the band and wrote about it often. (The drummer, Sheri Kaplan, ended up being the last drummer of the PANDORAS. The Hollywood music scene was quite incestuous.) I'm also thinking about posting a rather lengthy story I wrote about one of my drunken Hollywood nights. There was a big ass show with five or six all-girl bands playing. FELINE headlined the bill. I asked Susan what she thinks is the biggest misconception people have about all girl bands...
"The biggest misconception about the all girl band? I have no idea what the outside world thinks but I can tell you it's no sisterhood. It's very competitive and catty."
Okay, I guess I knew that response was coming. I hear that a lot. People think I've never been in a band simply because I can't play an instrument. Not true. I've never been in a (all girl) band because girls scare me. End of story.
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In concluding our chat I tossed in the meaningful and meaningless, the related and unrelated questions that y'all like so much. But I gave Susan Hyatt a break. I only asked nice questions.
Is it better to have loved and lost or loved and get stuck with someone who won't cook dinner for you?
"Being stuck is never an option for me. I get the hell out of there if things are not going my way. Settling for any relationship is like embracing death - it's a spirit killer. That's what my song 'They'll Never Luv U' is about. All these people in the UK are in relationships - it's like everyone is hooked up and afraid to be alone. It's hard for me to believe that all these people have found their soulmates. I don't like to waste my time hanging around with someone unless they are the shit."
Was your first guitar and amp a Sear's department store special?
"No. I was a spoiled kid. My first guitar was a Fender Strat and a Fender Twin Reverb amp. I have traded that in for a Gibson Les Paul Special and a Matchless. I need more meat and guts."
Is Emenim upholding freedom of speech or is he breeding hate?
"Emenim is very cool. A real artist. I heard he is Libran as well. I'm on his side. Freedom of speech all the way. I can totally relate to his parent conflicts."
Three words that best describe your personality?
"Ballsy, witty, determined."
What's the craziest thing you've done?
"The craziest thing I have done, on a date I went to the beach with this guy. I was on my period and he kept asking me to come into the ocean. I kept declining 'cause I had a big Maxi pad on - I don't do tampons. Finally, he irked me so much about asking why I would not come into the water that I took my pad out of my underwear and threw it at him. Needless to say that was our first and final date. Idiot."
What do you listen to when hanging out at your flat?
"I listen to the Cardigans. KISS - still. My all time favorite is Nine Inch Nails. I want to marry Trent Reznor. My rock idols are Trent Rezonr, Gene Simmons, Chrissie Hynde, David Bowie, and Prince."
Best celebrity run-in?
"I have been hanging out with musicians since I was 10-years-old. I have loads of celebrity run-ins. Where should I start? I can tell you I had one disastrous date with Mick Jagger. I suddenly turned into a mute. All I could think about was how he wrote 'Satisfaction' and 'Ruby Tuesday'. Another fond memory was when I had asked Iggy Pop to sign my 'Idiot' album. He took out his dick and pissed all over my album, and then handed it back to me with a smile. He is so punk rock!"
check out PILLBOX at: www.pillbox.co.uk
buy the records at: www.amazon.com (both US & UK)
www.cdbaby.com
and most every other music site on the 'Net!
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